Pastors Leading the flock???)

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On Tue, 15 Sep 1998 22:09:13 EDT FITZGEREL@aol.com writes:

>For instance, this Pastoral authority subject that you mention, I have 
>never been in a situation where the Pastor abuse his authority, 

If you were in such a situation, what WOULD you do?  The Bible says that
if a brother wrongs you, you are to go to him privately.  Would you do
that, or would you "exempt" him because he was a Pastor?

>so I have trouble seeing it from that disadvantage, 

Then take a moment and thank the Lord.

>but rather I see it from a position that God has put that individual 
>in my life to feed me with knowledge and understanding
>to equip me for the task of living for God.

Then really, you CAN understand how bad it feels when someone who is like
a parent to you personally abuses that authority.

> Also to shepherd me, and  if necessary to reprove, rebuke and exhort
with all with all 
>long-suffering and doctrine. 

Not with personal convictions, though, right?  Let me ask you this: if a
Pastor mandates a personal conviction of his as a Church standard, why
don't we have the right to ask him to live up to our personal convictions
as well?

That is the entirety of my problem here; it is an unscriptural elevation
of a Pastor to put him above the possibility of being wrong.  And the
teaching of PERSONAL CONVICTIONS as Doctrine is clearly out of order. 
Personal convictions are just THAT; personal, because they are tailored
for a unique individual; they are all but worthless to force others to
follow them.  Paul didn't say follow me as I follow my personal
convictions (which I am sure he had; and that is a part of Paul's
personal walk with Jesus), but he said "follow me as I follow Christ".

IOW, as long as a Pastor is IN the Word, they are within their scriptural
boundaries of authority, but once they start adding (or God help us
subtracting) from the Word of God, there is no scriptural authority in
their actions.

I have heard many times, "If he is wrong, God will take care of it" but I
am sure that if a saint were to get out of line, a Pastor wouldn't just
ignore it and say that he wouldn't do anything about it; let God handle
it".

> That doesn't mean that there hasn't been some mistakes over 
>the years,

That have not only hurt saints, but all but driven some of them out.  I
can quote case after case of Pastoral indifference to the exercise of
their authority and, yes, I know, no one can MAKE you sin, but if they
are pushing unscripturally at people, they are accomplices.  

>but I am much better off as the result of submitting to a 
>Pastor, than fighting him and being in contention with him.

To qualify my position, I don't believe that people should be fighting
Pastors or being in contention just to be argumentative.  Also, I
>>>DO<<< believe in the office of Pastor.  I just question the
extra-Biblical burdens (Acts 15:28,29) that are loaded on to saints.

>Also, this power structure and ranking system that you alluded to 
>above, I am sorry I can't take any credit for it at all.  I am as firm
in my 
>convictions that it is in the Word of God and ordained of God, and 
>besides all of that it has never hurt me yet.

But you do not deny that it has not hurt anyone, do you?  And it is not
GOD'S power structure at fault; it is the additional power that men have
grabbed for themselves.  Preach the Word and you are IN the Word.  Preach
outside the Word and there is no guarantee.  I just cringe anytime I hear
a near Papal description of a Pastor.  It's not healthy for either the
Pastor OR the Saint and it's certainly not scriptural.

>Besides I had rather stand before God with my regard
>for my Pastor, than trade places with anyone that has had bad 
>experiences with the gift that God has put into their lives.  

Just be glad and thank God.  I know of alot of souls outside of Church
who shouldn't be there.

>But if you would like to address the responsible party for the 
>power structure and ranking system, what ever
>that is, He is just a prayer away.    God Bless
>
>Pastor Fitzgerel

I do not believe that God has called, ordained or promotes Pastors to
preach their personal convictions, much less promote them as equally as
they do Doctrine that is contained in the Bible.  By making any such
claim to scriptural authority, they place themselves on a Pedestal too
high for them to have any place in.

Jerry Welch
ICQ: 18489712
www.geocities.com/Athens/Aegean/2810/

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