TEMPTING...

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Gerry said:

>We all have an 'old man nature' that continuyes to surface and bring
>back the way we used to do things.  This, I have found in my life, is
>the greatest source of temptation - to be like I used to be, without
>God and without hope in this world.
>
> If we are
>transformed by the power of Christ, through the Holy Spirit, how far
>does that transformation go?  Let me use an analogy.  If we go to the
>doctor to have that disease treated, say, a gallbladder operation, we
>are transformed and will presumably never have any trouble with it
>again, since it has been cured.  Is this not appropriate here?
>

I have struggled with this very important issue for a few years.
I feel it is one of the MOST important studies.

The transformation that is readily seen by all born again believers
involves our forgiveness of sins.  But nowhere does the Bible say God
directly deals with us and our SIN.  He only deals with us
indirectly THROUGH CHRIST.  We need faith that is directed to God
THROUGH Christ.

SINS are directly dealt with at our conversion, but not SIN, as
such.  Sin is a principle and resides in our flesh.  We can live above
it but it is not extracted from us directly.

God directly annihilates sins and their remembrance by the blood.  But
the sin PRINCIPLE is dealt with indirectly.  When it comes to
righteous LIVING, we enjoy victory when we see and understand, and
then work from the fact that God doesn't remove sin but the
sinner. (You must see how sins and sin are two different things,
first.  Sins are acts and sin is a principle or law.)

Ro. 6:6 says that our old man is crucified, thus God deals indirectly
with sin.  He removes the sinner.  We see the BODY unemployed by
sin since the old man is gone.  The term for the KJV "destroyed" in
Ro. 6:6 is actually intended by Paul to infer "put out of commission"
or "rendered ineffective."  Not annihilated.

Look at is as though sin is the master who is still around.  But the
slave is gone now and the slave's body cannot be used by the master,
but used for God as His instruments of righteousness (6:13).

We don't really have victory over sin, as such, but rather victory
BECAUSE of the deliverance from sin.  RO. 6:7-11 involves words such
as "dead to sin" and "freed" implying victory through deliverance.

So when it comes to temptation and the FACT that we do indeed feel an
urge within to do wrong, I look at it as though Satan was trying to
make Eve doubt a divine fact by a lie.  It was a fact that Eve would
die should she eat of the bad tree.  Satan said she would not die.

Similarly, I sin and err today.  Satan lies to me and says, "You are
not dead.  Look at your action today.  And how do you feel?  Feel
lousy about it?  See!  You're not dead."

I must realise that Satan will not stop at words when he lies, but
lying signs as well.  Even though I did sin and though I do feel very
much that I did not die, I AM STILL DEAD in Christ.  We take things,
such as mistakes and sins, incorrectly.  Committing sins does not mean
we are not dead in Christ.

What they mean is that sin is still in us and, when given a chance,
will rise up and cause damage.  So we need to know how to not give it
a chance, and learn how the blood works.   We need to learn how that
the fatc that we have sinned is not to be interpreted as proof that we
are not dead with Christ.  It must be properly looked at as being
evidence of our lack of abiding in Him by faith, and a trying to cease
>from sin on our own accord.

(I've been teaching on this very topic of late in our church.)

> The re-emergence of
>the old man (the recurrence of the disease) is the natural outcome of
>not renewing our minds to the commandments of God.  (I Jn 5:14).

Amen.  To change our old concepts and begin looking at it all so
differently, as Go'd Word teaches it, is to take on a large task that
so many will never take, for it is the changing of such a large
concept.  It is renewing our minds.  Paul's approach, which is
obviously the right one to take, is to look at oursleves as being dead
in Christ.  Then we must work from that standpoint.  But the concept
change is what will hinder so many from beginning right there.

I would not say that we must renew our minds to the commandments, but
rather renew them to the fact that we are dead with Christ.  That was
Paul's approach in Romans 6.  John's words regarding Law, I believe,
were meant to say that if we truly love God we will automatically keep
the commandments.  The Law, though, is not our DIRECT concern.  Our
concern is the FACT that we are dead with Christ.  Law-abiding will
follow quite naturally after that.

> We have our
>lives transformed by the operation; we have our lives transformed by
>the Spirit, so we are no longer under the power of sin.  (I realize
>simile and metaphor are very dangerous, even at their very best.  I
>do not, however, use this as an allegory.)

Our lives can only be transformed as far as practical action  each
day by a continual abiding in Christ each day.  The definition of
abiding in Christ is the conscious act of ever believing the FACT that
we are dead in Him and we are risen IN HIM.

Unless I send my mail through the post office in my town, it will not
get to you.  This is similar to the fact that I must go through Christ
by believing all that is His is mine, since He did it all for me.  And
upon that standpoint, I will then claim all the victory He possesses.
But I need a revelation, or as Paul put it, a KNOWLEDGE of that (Ro.
6).

There must be taht conscious exertion of faith in Him each day I live.
 Otherwise I will not maintain the victory, or I will, as it
were, leave Christ.

>Much like the serpent tempting Eve: she knew
>better (she was specifically commanded not to and knew the
>consequences), but she and the serpent justified the action by
>claiming themselves that it was a good thing.
>
>The reference to Eve is one of those with which I have struggled for
>years.  Let me lay it out as I see it:
 
[,,,]
>Given these factors, why should they be punished for disobedience,
>which they had no reason to believe was wrong until it was too late?
>Eve was indeed the "first ethical philosopher", but became such by
>virtue of her ignorance.

I do not look at Eve's suituation as punishment due to disobedience,
but rather the effects caused by her departure from God.  When she
tried to rise to higher heights of being apart from God's LIFE, and on
her own, she departed from LIFE.  And when you walk away from life you
will naturally die.  God would not zap her in death, but she walked
away from Him right on into death.  She may not have realised her
actions, but being deceived she still suffered the EFFECT.

        >But Adam was in the transgression when he ate without being
>deceived, when he allowed Eve to feed him the forbidden and did not
>put his foot down.

Amen.

Great topic, Gerry!
God bless!
Mike Blume