I was looking throught the changelog and noticed in the 1.7.9alpha1 section, Pavel enabled create() to allow kids of #-1. This works fine, but the problem is children(#-1) returns E_INVARG. No big deal, I easily patched it with #0:bf_children. Small bug, but a bug is a bug :) - Justin Rebel - RebelMOO vader.macatawa.com 9898 http://vader.macatawa.com:9999